February 6, 20205 yr https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/05/business/bernie-madoff-prison-release-request/index.html?utm_source=twCNN&utm_medium=social&utm_content=2020-02-05T23%3A30%3A10&utm_term=link
February 6, 20205 yr Ebbers got released, too, and promptly died. I'm fine with this. Incarceration of the old and dying serves no purpose.
February 6, 20205 yr Thread title is a little nondescript. Maybe "WTF is going on with Bernie Madoff" would help people understand if they should click or not.
February 6, 20205 yr If he’s currently refusing dialysis and has been alleging that he’s suffering from stage 4 kidney disease since 2014, then that casts enough doubt for me to say he should stay right where he is. Take your dialysis and submit to an independent medical exam, and I might be persuaded to reconsider.
February 6, 20205 yr 5 minutes ago, Player said: If he’s currently refusing dialysis and has been alleging that he’s suffering from stage 4 kidney disease since 2014, then that casts enough doubt for me to say he should stay right where he is. Take your dialysis and submit to an independent medical exam, and I might be persuaded to reconsider. His diagnosis and prognosis is established by the BOP. He's not subject to "independent medical exam." End-stage renal disease is a step beyond Stage 4. I suppose if he's released, he shouldn't be allowed to start dialysis.
February 6, 20205 yr Fuck him, he screwed so many people. If he doesn't want the prison healthcare system, oh well. He made his bed.
February 6, 20205 yr Ebbers got released, too, and promptly died. I'm fine with this. Incarceration of the old and dying serves no purpose.I generally agree with this. But this guy fucked over a lot of people. He deserves to stay in
February 6, 20205 yr 51 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said: His diagnosis and prognosis is established by the BOP. He's not subject to "independent medical exam." End-stage renal disease is a step beyond Stage 4. I suppose if he's released, he shouldn't be allowed to start dialysis. I think justice is better served by leaving him where he is, making reasonable medical care available to him, and letting nature take its course. Dying alone in prison without all of the comforts that his remaining wealth might provide if he were granted "compassionate release" might serve as a deterrent to others.
February 6, 20205 yr 1 hour ago, StruggleBus said: Let him go but make him move to Oklahoma You masochist sicko fuck!
February 6, 20205 yr 1 hour ago, Player said: I think justice is better served by leaving him where he is, making reasonable medical care available to him, and letting nature take its course. Dying alone in prison without all of the comforts that his remaining wealth might provide if he were granted "compassionate release" might serve as a deterrent to others. I suppose I can buy a value judgment that he should remain imprisoned. I do not buy the deterrent effect. People like Madoff aren't deterred, they think they won't be caught. Whether they die in prison or at home has little or no bearing on that.
February 6, 20205 yr Let him go but make him move to Oklahoma You gotta problem with the 8th amendment brah?
February 6, 20205 yr 2 minutes ago, Surly Bevo said: You gotta problem with the 8th amendment brah? No, I’m fine with women voting
February 6, 20205 yr 3 hours ago, TwiceHorn said: Ebbers got released, too, and promptly died. I'm fine with this. Incarceration of the old and dying serves no purpose. I disagree. It has a deterrent effect.
February 6, 20205 yr I suppose I can buy a value judgment that he should remain imprisoned. I do not buy the deterrent effect. People like Madoff aren't deterred, they think they won't be caught. Whether they die in prison or at home has little or no bearing on that.I get you, but a lot of poor people die every day in prison for less reason than him in my opinionMaybe not the best argument. Hell, I had more sympathy for aaraon Hernandez.
February 6, 20205 yr yeah, I'm pretty much in the "fuck that guy" group {needs to check my 2020 celebrity deathwatch list}
February 6, 20205 yr 14 hours ago, TwiceHorn said: I suppose I can buy a value judgment that he should remain imprisoned. I do not buy the deterrent effect. People like Madoff aren't deterred, they think they won't be caught. Whether they die in prison or at home has little or no bearing on that. Hmm. I would think Ponzi scheme operators would be different than most financial criminals in that respect. Everyone knows that every Ponzi scheme eventually collapses. The gamble would seem to be not that you won't get caught, but that you will bail before you get caught. Getting caught has to be part of the calculus, right?
February 6, 20205 yr I will still never understand, how gossiping traders on Wall Street never noticed that none of them had Bernie's firm trading through them with active tickets. These guys are the epitome of the wanna-be cool kids table in high school cafeterias and none of them ever noticed, "Yeah, it sucks...we'd love to have some Bernie's shop trading through us." And of course due to egos, everybody else in the bar said the same thing. But you'd think after that many years, those egos would finally ask, "I get it, he's not using us. But who's he using? Would love to find out their secret sauce." I realize the technology and law enforcement wasn't there yet at the time, and complacency and greed led the investors not to ask questions or demand proper reporting, but how did all those traders and third-party counterparts never wonder, 'Hey, who actually clears these billions every quarter'?" And you can't say greed. Because greed is precisely what would leave traders to actively inquire about who was pushing these buy-sale orders through. They'd want to know so they could either bad mouth them to get the new business or they'd try to pony up pari passou with these shops. That's the last mystery about him. IMO, anyway... Edited February 6, 20205 yr by Lobo
February 6, 20205 yr This man single handedly destroyed thousands upon thousands of peoples lives. I'm sure people died prematurely as a result of his embezzlement scheme. Rot in hell sir. Let God (if there is one) sort out his forgiveness.
February 6, 20205 yr 14 hours ago, BrickHorn said: I disagree. It has a deterrent effect. Hmm. A ponzi schemer says, welp, if I get caught, I'll go to prison, but at least I won't die there? LETS DO IT!
February 6, 20205 yr 31 minutes ago, Huckleberry said: Hmm. I would think Ponzi scheme operators would be different than most financial criminals in that respect. Everyone knows that every Ponzi scheme eventually collapses. The gamble would seem to be not that you won't get caught, but that you will bail before you get caught. Getting caught has to be part of the calculus, right? I think the tendency with Ponzi schemers is that they divert funds to personal use, pay dividends from investments, see how easy it is and then the thing rapidly grows out of control. At some point, yeah, they probably figure that they'll get caught, but the crime is nearly complete. The prospect of apprehension and punishment had no deterrent effect at that point. Nonetheless, as with the post above, I don't think the (un)availability of compassionate release figures heavily into their calculation. People are just straining to find a reason to indulge bloodlust without acknowledging it. Edited February 6, 20205 yr by TwiceHorn
February 6, 20205 yr Not to diminish his crime or to argue for an early release, but the latest report I could fund is that the litigation trustee has so far distributed 76% of the amounts lost by investors. He’s done that by suing those earlier investors that made a profit as well as other investment companies and financial institutions that dealt with Madoff. No doubt many of the victims quickly sold their claims to claims traders at very low amounts just happy to get anything, and those traders have done very well.
February 6, 20205 yr 3 minutes ago, HouTex said: Not to diminish his crime or to argue for an early release, but the latest report I could fund is that the litigation trustee has so far distributed 76% of the amounts lost by investors. He’s done that by suing those earlier investors that made a profit as well as other investment companies and financial institutions that dealt with Madoff. No doubt many of the victims quickly sold their claims to claims traders at very low amounts just happy to get anything, and those traders have done very well. Yeah, that's amazing good work by that trustee.
February 6, 20205 yr Yeah, that's amazing good work by that trustee.I agree. That said, many of the claims he made were no brainers. There’s a lot of case law on claims against the winners (i.e. those who are net in the money—even innocently) in a Ponzi scheme.
February 6, 20205 yr Meanwhile, Jon Corzine stole $1.2 billion and never saw the inside of a prison cell, because he’s well connected. Three years ago he settled with the CFTC for $5 million, or 0.4% of what he stole. Pretty cool.
February 6, 20205 yr Meanwhile, Jon Corzine stole $1.2 billion and never saw the inside of a prison cell, because he’s well connected. Three years ago he settled with the CFTC for $5 million, or 0.4% of what he stole. Pretty cool.I remember reading about that. Pretty fucked up
February 6, 20205 yr 14 minutes ago, HouTex said: I agree. That said, many of the claims he made were no brainers. There’s a lot of case law on claims against the winners (i.e. those who are net in the money—even innocently) in a Ponzi scheme. Oh yeah. Even so, you don't see that success rate too often. The "local" Stanford receivership has collected a tiny fraction of that. And I think the Madoff percentage is net of legal fees, to boot.
February 7, 20205 yr 1 hour ago, mulletpelini said: I thought this mfer was already dead. I think his son died.
February 7, 20205 yr 2 minutes ago, XYZ said: I think his son died. Both of em. One by suicide other by cancer.
February 7, 20205 yr 8 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said: This man single handedly destroyed thousands upon thousands of peoples lives. I'm sure people died prematurely as a result of his embezzlement scheme. Rot in hell sir. Let God (if there is one) sort out his forgiveness. He got Kevin Bacon and that chick of his, lost thousands, consequently millions.
February 7, 20205 yr 18 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said: Both of em. One by suicide other by cancer. That’s a shame gif
April 14, 20214 yr Bernie Madoff died. Natural causes. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/04/14/bernie-madoff-dies-mastermind-of-the-nations-biggest-investment-fraud-was-82.html Edited April 14, 20214 yr by Willfully Horn Link
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