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1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

Primary issue also not visible:

James Comey's handing of the Clinton press conference likely had the single greatest external influence on the election results (538 Link). Another issue that wasn't visible in the report was the Russian disinformation operation targeting the FBI that influenced Comey's decision to hold that press conference (WaPo Link). Wonder why the former Director of the FBI would leave something as potentially impactful to the election, driven right through the halls of the FBI, out of the report on Russian election interference? 

Yes, clearly we need to make sure Comey doesn’t do a press conference again in the next election cycle.  Never mind the ongoing Russian information warfare.  Comey press conferences are the real threat to democracy. 

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    liberals suddenly being terrified of Russia and manic for election integrity is just pure comedy gold.

  • I don't believe for a moment that any of this is entertaining to you.  I think it gives you a bit of anxiety knowing that your best weapon against a group who you despise is a bumbling fraud as a busi

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He's just making sure we understand that everyone except Donald Trump is to blame.

I get it.  You have a very narrow scope of interest in understanding the multifaceted Russian interference campaign, especially when it strikes a little too close to your tree-gazing homey and potential failures in the intelligence community. 

Just now, kevwun said:

He's just making sure we understand that everyone except Donald Trump is to blame.

If you can peg coordination to Trump, hang his ass on the Hill.  Or use the obstruction section and impeach him.  You got everything that you need for the latter. Why not done?

Because of a turtle from Kentucky and his merry band of assholes in the Senate.

4 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I get it.  You have a very narrow scope of interest in understanding the multifaceted Russian interference campaign, especially when it strikes a little too close to your tree-gazing homey and potential failures in the intelligence community. 

I'm amazed that anyone left of center or anti-Trump would hold Comey in any esteem whatsoever. He directly contributed to Trump's presidency, and has done nothing but act like an attention whore since. His constant Twitter beefs with Trump have only added fuel to the "Mueller and his 97 angry Democrats" bullshit. The guy is a clown.

I am astonished that Hillary's emails are still brought up.  It's gonna be 2030 and the rubes will still be talking about Hillary's emails.

4 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I get it.  You have a very narrow scope of interest in understanding the multifaceted Russian interference campaign, especially when it strikes a little too close to your tree-gazing homey and potential failures in the intelligence community. 

I don't have a problem evaluating whether and to what extent the investigation into Hillary and Comey's (perhaps ill-considered in hindsight) press conferences were somehow orchestrated by Russia.  I do think that at this point, given how far we've come since all of that occurred that to conduct an expansive investigation would not be the most effective use of governmental and investigative resources.

 

Just now, DDD Dad said:

I don't have a problem evaluating whether and to what extent the investigation into Hillary and Comey's (perhaps ill-considered in hindsight) press conferences were somehow orchestrated by Russia.  I do think that at this point, given how far we've come since all of that occurred that to conduct an expansive investigation would not be the most effective use of governmental and investigative resources.

You don't think that maybe it's a little interesting that the 2+ year investigation into Russian attempts to influence the outcome of the election didn't even touch on the Russian disinformation that played a role in the single greatest external event that influenced the election? I do.  I think that it is because the former Director of the FBI isn't going to put much scrutiny to the actions of the FBI in his report. 

  • Author

Comey fucked up, twice, but he’s not the issue here.  Anastasis is just stirring the pot and deflecting from the important issues, like the actual crimes committed by the president and Russia. 

He would get paid top dollar in St Petersburg 

5 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

You don't think that maybe it's a little interesting that the 2+ year investigation into Russian attempts to influence the outcome of the election didn't even touch on the Russian disinformation that played a role in the single greatest external event that influenced the election? I do.  I think that it is because the former Director of the FBI isn't going to put much scrutiny to the actions of the FBI in his report. 

I wouldn't be at all surprised that this topic is the current subject of a counterintelligence investigation and as a result has not been made public.  

Edit:  If it isn't it should be (or should have been).  Whether the results of such investigation should be made public is a different matter altogether.

Edited by DDD Dad

2 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

You don't think that maybe it's a little interesting that the 2+ year investigation into Russian attempts to influence the outcome of the election didn't even touch on the Russian disinformation that played a role in the single greatest external event that influenced the election? I do.  I think that it is because the former Director of the FBI isn't going to put much scrutiny to the actions of the FBI in his report. 

What role did that disinformation play in what James Comey did at his press conference?

 

4 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

He would get paid top dollar in St Petersburg 

Do I still get to relish in the suffering of children with cancer if I take up the bot troll gig? Because that is where I find the real joy in my life. 

Edited by Anastasis

Just now, David Dennison said:

What role did that disinformation play in what James Comey did at his press conference?

I linked the wapo article.  Click it incognito if you dont subscribe. 

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

Primary issue also not visible:

James Comey's handing of the Clinton press conference likely had the single greatest external influence on the election results (538 Link). Another issue that wasn't visible in the report was the Russian disinformation operation targeting the FBI that influenced Comey's decision to hold that press conference (WaPo Link). Wonder why the former Director of the FBI would leave something as potentially impactful to the election, driven right through the halls of the FBI, out of the report on Russian election interference? 

Your WaPo link is broken.  Please elaborate.  You seem to go out of your way to cast shade in every direction BUT Donald Trump.  You're doing it again.

2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Your WaPo link is broken.  Please elaborate.  You seem to go out of your way to cast shade in every direction BUT Donald Trump.  You're doing it again.

Well fuck me.  https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/how-a-dubious-russian-document-influenced-the-fbis-handling-of-the-clinton-probe/2017/05/24/f375c07c-3a95-11e7-9e48-c4f199710b69_story.html?

As far as Trump, the obstruction portion of the report is enough to impeach him and remove him from office IMO. I have also shared my thoughts on the political realities around impeachment and removal. Long after Trump is gone in Jan 2021, we're still going to have a corrupted and unconstitutional surveillance state.  I see an angle to draw some focus to that, so I am going to go ahead and amplify it. It would have gone over really well with the current make up of this board if it was surveillance abuses under Bush, but hey, we play the cards we are dealt. 

Edited by Anastasis

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

Primary issue also not visible:

James Comey's handing of the Clinton press conference likely had the single greatest external influence on the election results (538 Link). Another issue that wasn't visible in the report was the Russian disinformation operation targeting the FBI that influenced Comey's decision to hold that press conference (WaPo Link). Wonder why the former Director of the FBI would leave something as potentially impactful to the election, driven right through the halls of the FBI, out of the report on Russian election interference? 

Mueller mandate

Quote

The Special Counsel is authorized to conduct the investigation confinned by then-FBI

Director James 8. Corney in testimony before the House Permanent Select Committee on
Intelligence on March 20, 2017, including:
(i)

any links and/or coordination bet ween the Russian government and individuals
associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump; and

(c)

(ii)

any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation; and

(iii)

any other matters within the scope of 28 C.F.R. § 600.4(a).

If the Special Counsel believes it is necessary and appropriate, the Special Counsel is

authorized to prosecute federal crimes arising from the investigation of these matters.

While possible Russian disinformation leading to Comey's press conference might tangentially fall within the scope of ii and iii it does not seem to me to fall within the primary scope of Mueller's mandate.

 

In other words, let's move past the whatabouts and but Comey's for this thread.  Shall we?

Edited by DDD Dad

4 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

OK, so Comey got trolled by a Russian document.  It would seem this furthers the narrative that he's possibly not the brightest bulb in the FBI, and somewhat of an attention whore as well.  How does this in any way diminish the efforts by Manafort, Junior, Kushner et al to engage and enable Russians in their attempt to sway the election (which ACTUALLY HAPPENED)?

Comey fucked up, twice, but he’s not the issue here.  Anastasis is just stirring the pot and deflecting from the important issues, like the actual crimes committed by the president and Russia. 

He would get paid top dollar in St Petersburg 

I mean, Ana definitely gets hung up on FISA and IMO seems to have a double standard in terms of guilt, where he's really upset about Obama and FISA but thinks everyone should move on from the inconclusive Mueller report.

 

But separating the FISA stuff from Trump/Mueller, he's not wrong. Despite Obama being the best president this century (literally not even debatable), his failure to reign in FISA, domestic surveillance and Gitmo are extremely disappointing.

 

That by no means excuses Trump, though. Two separate issues.

29 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I linked the wapo article.  Click it incognito if you dont subscribe. 

Yeah, I'm not seeing what the big deal is, particularly since Hillary Clinton isn't the president.

 

I mean, Ana definitely gets hung up on FISA and IMO seems to have a double standard in terms of guilt, where he's really upset about Obama and FISA but thinks everyone should move on from the inconclusive Mueller report.  
But separating the FISA stuff from Trump/Mueller, he's not wrong. Despite Obama being the best president this century (literally not even debatable), his failure to reign in FISA, domestic surveillance and Gitmo are extremely disappointing.
 
That by no means excuses Trump, though. Two separate issues.

Rein
  • Author

Just finished reading Appendix C of the Mueller Report which is Trump’s written responses to Mueller’s questions.  

TL:DR summary:

It is an absolute beating to read.  Almost every response begins with some variation of “I have no recollection, I do not recall” and sometimes followed by bragging about winning such and such states followed by attacking Hillary Clinton and citing “Clinton Cash” as his source of information.  

Based on the responses, assuming Trump is telling the truth (he obviously isn’t), he could be the dumbest man alive. 

Edited by Hugo Stiglitz

2 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Just finished reading Appendix C of the Mueller Report which is Trump’s written responses to Mueller’s questions.  

TL:DR summary:

It is an absolute beating to read.  Almost every response begins with some variation of “I have no recollection, I do not recall” and sometimes followed by bragging about winning such and such states followed by attacking Hillary Clinton and citing “Clinton Cash” as his source of information.  

Based on the responses, assuming Trump is telling the truth (he obviously isn’t), he could be the dumbest man alive. 

The best memory.

7 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Just finished reading Appendix C of the Mueller Report which is Trump’s written responses to Mueller’s questions.  

TL:DR summary:

It is an absolute beating to read.  Almost every response begins with some variation of “I have no recollection, I do not recall” and sometimes followed by bragging about winning such and such states followed by attacking Hillary Clinton and citing “Clinton Cash” as his source of information.  

Based on the responses, assuming Trump is telling the truth (he obviously isn’t), he could be the dumbest man alive. 

0:18-0:48

1 hour ago, BradInATX said:

I mean, Ana definitely gets hung up on FISA and IMO seems to have a double standard in terms of guilt, where he's really upset about Obama and FISA but thinks everyone should move on from the inconclusive Mueller report.

 

But separating the FISA stuff from Trump/Mueller, he's not wrong. Despite Obama being the best president this century (literally not even debatable), his failure to reign in FISA, domestic surveillance and Gitmo are extremely disappointing.

 

That by no means excuses Trump, though. Two separate issues.

The general issue of FISA approvals being way too easy for investigators to get is a real concern and wholly separate from Anastasis' bullshit concern trolling that the Obama admin abused the FISA process to spy on Trump in an effort to keep him from getting elected. Carter Page was essentially walking around with a giant "I AM A RUSSIAN INTELLIGENCE ASSET" sign on his back for years and they didn't even begin surveilling him until after he had left the campaign, and the Mueller report makes clear that it was George getting drunk and blabbing about working with Russia to the Australian diplomat that prompted the investigation in the first place.

Anastasis is promoting a dumbass conspiracy theory that makes no sense when scrutinized for more than three seconds in order to redirect attention from the campaign's rampant illegality. 

Conspiracy theory in a 500+ page thread loaded with conspiracy theories...

3 minutes ago, EuroHorn said:

Conspiracy theory in a 500+ page thread loaded with conspiracy theories...

What's the conspiracy theory in the report?

Totally crazy and conspiratorial to think and be sensitive that the FBI might interfere in the US political process. J. Edgar rolling over in his grave at the notion. 

Totally insane to invent a historical pattern of FISA abuse. Not like the FBI has ever been caught abusing the system by filing inaccurate FISA warrants.

Conspiracy theories by concern trolls!

 

Just now, Anastasis said:

Totally crazy and conspiratorial to think and be sensitive that the FBI might interfere in the US political process. J. Edgar rolling over in his grave at the notion. 

Totally insane to invent a historical pattern of FISA abuse. Not like the FBI has ever been caught abusing the system by filing inaccurate FISA warrants.

Conspiracy theories by concern trolls!

I guess all of the judges are in on it, too.

#DeepState

1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

Totally crazy and conspiratorial to think and be sensitive that the FBI might interfere in the US political process. J. Edgar rolling over in his grave at the notion. 

Totally insane to invent a historical pattern of FISA abuse. Not like the FBI has ever been caught abusing the system by filing inaccurate FISA warrants.

Conspiracy theories by concern trolls!

 

Never said any of that. All I said was that YOUR theory is stupid. Really though, that's understating it. Your theory isn't just stupid, it's incredibly fucking stupid. I'm talking Swam on a bender levels of stupid.

 

1 hour ago, BradInATX said:

Ana definitely gets hung up on FISA and IMO seems to have a double standard in terms of guilt, where he's really upset about Obama and FISA

To be fair Brad,  I was critical of the same exact things and more under Bush's administration. 

26 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

Mueller mandate

While possible Russian disinformation leading to Comey's press conference might tangentially fall within the scope of ii and iii it does not seem to me to fall within the primary scope of Mueller's mandate.

In other words, let's move past the whatabouts and but Comey's for this thread.  Shall we?

So financial crimes related to lobbying work in Ukraine 2012, unrelated to our election, in scope; Russian operation targeting FBI 2016 and influence actions of the Director, directly related to election outcome, out of scope. Got it. 

23 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

OK, so Comey got trolled by a Russian document.  It would seem this furthers the narrative that he's possibly not the brightest bulb in the FBI, and somewhat of an attention whore as well.  How does this in any way diminish the efforts by Manafort, Junior, Kushner et al to engage and enable Russians in their attempt to sway the election (which ACTUALLY HAPPENED)?

I think that their actions should stand on their own and if there were crimes committed directly related to election interference or coordination they should be prosecuted.  However, I think that the Mueller report only bolsters what I have been arguing for years here, that the Trump campaign was clown show central, unable to effectively coordinate among themselves, much less with Russia to interfere in the election.  And surely not capable or coordination on the level of the Cohen-Prague organization and financing of the hacking operations.  

I am not sure that I ever directly compare various external forces that influenced the the election, but I what I did say was that Comey's press conference was the single greatest external influence on the outcome of the election. That is pretty much a fact that everybody agrees on. Data support that position. If you are pissed off that Trump was elected, a substantial portion of your ire should be pointed at James Comey specifically. If Russian disinformation played a role in influencing his actions, seems kinda like something we should talk about. But please, yes, let's also save some attention for hardening our electorate against twitter operations and memes and phishing operations.  That is definitely important moving forward as well.

3 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

If you are pissed off that Trump was elected, a substantial portion of your ire should be pointed at James Comey specifically. If Russian disinformation played a role in influencing his actions, seems kinda like something we should talk about. But please, yes, let's also save some attention for hardening our electorate against twitter operations and memes and phishing operations.  That is definitely important moving forward as well.

I am not unconcerned with Russian influence on our intelligence community.

I am not unconcerned that Comey's actions affected the election. 

Neither is as worrisome as Donald Trump's brazen attempts to destroy our country.  If this isn't your perspective, then I don't know what to say.  It's callous, short-sighted, and fundamentally un-American.  If that's you in a nutshell, so be it.  Good luck with what's coming down.

 

I think that their actions should stand on their own and if there were crimes committed directly related to election interference or coordination they should be prosecuted.  However, I think that the Mueller report only bolsters what I have been arguing for years here, that the Trump campaign was clown show central, unable to effectively coordinate among themselves, much less with Russia to interfere in the election.  And surely not capable or coordination on the level of the Cohen-Prague organization and financing of the hacking operations.  

I am not sure that I ever directly compare various external forces that influenced the the election, but I what I did say was that Comey's press conference was the single greatest external influence on the outcome of the election. That is pretty much a fact that everybody agrees on. Data support that position. If you are pissed off that Trump was elected, a substantial portion of your ire should be pointed at James Comey specifically. If Russian disinformation played a role in influencing his actions, seems kinda like something we should talk about. But please, yes, let's also save some attention for hardening our electorate against twitter operations and memes and phishing operations.  That is definitely important moving forward as well.

Well my example didn’t develop from the investigation. It was already out there before Mueller was appointed. On the other hand the financial crimes and Ukraine connection was developed during the course of the investigation. In other words squarely within the scope of the mandate.

 

Seems like there was secret cooperation between Trump’s campaign and Russian operatives in order to deceive and cheat by decimating hacked data and microtarget troll messaging. If only there were a term for that...

Ongoing lines of inquiry in the house off the top of my head.

- trump taxes (I’m not really sure what could come out of this but it seems there is a reason to keep secret)

- trump org finances (Cummings has issued a subpoena and it’s going to court)

- White House security clearances (Cummings has issued a subpoena but White House is fighting)

- Family separation policy (I haven’t seen much about this since Feb)

- Mueller’s findings (I understand Barr, McGahn, Mueller are all expected to testify)

- Emoluments violations (Engel is running with I believe)

 

14 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Never said any of that. All I said was that YOUR theory is stupid. Really though, that's understating it. Your theory isn't just stupid, it's incredibly fucking stupid. I'm talking Swam on a bender levels of stupid.

Here is a reasonable outline of my working theory.  I can cite the vast majority of this from declassified materials and sworn testimony. There are a couple areas that require some logical connecting of the dots. Oh, and Brennan should be replaced with Clapper.  Got my spooks confused.  But please go on.  Try to use another argument tactic other than name calling. 

19 hours ago, Anastasis said:

Washington Free Beacon, Rubio, Steele Russia focus started after DNC took over.  It served as a significant input into the investigation,  inserted into the IC via conduits into the FBI with conflicts of interest and State Department officials, and substantive portions were used in FISA applications without verification.  Apparently Brennan tried to have portions inserted in the assessment of Russian interference (first I heard that one, in video linked above). Not surprising since Brennan was also leaking it to journalists and coordinating with Comey to have it publicly released around the same time, coinciding with the FBI's assessment that the quality of the sources were seriously flawed.  Reports are that the FBI IG is zeroing in on Steele for his report, and that Steele has refused to cooperate.  None of that is conspiracy theory, all statements can be cited. But nothing to investigate here.  

 

  • Popular Post

Great planning by Hillary. "Hey guys, let's launder falsified intelligence to our buddies at the FBI, who just fucking love Democrats and hate Republicans, to initiate a counterintelligence investigation into Trump's campaign to help us win the election. Then, and this is the real genius, let's never publicly reveal or in any way use any information gleaned from that investigation until after the election has already occurred, but let's make sure to go to Mitch fucking McConnell and ask him to put out a bipartisan statement that Russia is trying to tamper with the election. And to really throw the hounds off our trail, we'll tell our good buddy James Comey to publicly re-open the investigation into me a week before the election."

 

42 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Neither is as worrisome as Donald Trump's brazen attempts to destroy our country.  If this isn't your perspective, then I don't know what to say.  It's callous, short-sighted, and fundamentally un-American.  If that's you in a nutshell, so be it.  Good luck with what's coming down.

I think that there is everything needed to justify removing him from office. You don't need a fantasy conspiracy built around coordination with Russia to do it.  There are a long list of impeachable offenses.  Run with it.  Shit, I'd vote for impeachment and removal at this point if in the position. I think that the obstruction portion of the report would be sufficient to my mind, and could be overlaid with a number of other charges. If I was in the cabinet I would have supported removal after Helsinki.  I said basically as much at the time. Maybe a I need to find a new nutshell. 

Edited by Anastasis

53 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Great planning by Hillary.

Nothing in my outline said anything about Hillary. But if you want to go there, I think that she was buffered from direct involvement in my outline.  Trump used a mob style framework to buffer around him. Hillary had a strong safety net built around her by the DNC and Perkins Coie, in this specific case. I do think however that she deployed certain fruits of the oppo work related to Russia during the campaign. Especially as some of that work was laundered through the intelligence community. 

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

Here is a reasonable outline of my working theory.  I can cite the vast majority of this from declassified materials and sworn testimony. There are a couple areas that require some logical connecting of the dots. Oh, and Brennan should be replaced with Clapper.  Got my spooks confused.  But please go on.  Try to use another argument tactic other than name calling. 

 

I'm going to need this in diagram form with colored pointy arrow lines and pictures if I'm to make any sense of it.

8 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Nothing in my outline said anything about Hillary. But if you want to go there, I think that she was buffered from direct involvement in my outline.  Trump used a mob style framework to buffer around him. Hillary had a strong safety net built around her by the DNC and Perkins Coie, in this specific case. I do think however that she deployed certain fruits of the oppo work related to Russia during the campaign. Especially as some of that work was laundered through the intelligence community. 

Like what?

18 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

me yeah she does. Fuck you for the comment 

 

 

The wife's sharp as shit with decades of experience in the insurance field  It was the SCC state corp. Commission, and its indicitive of state agencies in Va.  and is also typical of federal agencies.

 

over staffed,

no deadlines

entrenched routines 

no motivation to innovate 

difficult to fire personnel 

 

she got the hell out  because everything was so stupidly, an ineffiecntly run

Or maybe she sucks and cannot hack it.   You are promoting a myth based on anecdotal hearsay.  That description above could include several private sector jobs I have had.  Weatherford - lost $700,000,000 USD in one year, and gave the CEO $7,000,000.   When they had issues, they would recycle management, rename departments and not address real issues.  They did that several times, each time thinking it was going to work.  

 

Just now, Nivek said:

Or maybe she sucks and cannot hack it.   You are promoting a myth based on anecdotal hearsay.  That description above could include several private sector jobs I have had.  Weatherford - lost $700,000,000 USD in one year, and gave the CEO $7,000,000.   When they had issues, they would recycle management, rename departments and not address real issues.  They did that several times, each time thinking it was going to work.  

 

Maybe you suck dick down at the local grey hound station.

4 minutes ago, Nivek said:

Or maybe she sucks and cannot hack it.   You are promoting a myth based on anecdotal hearsay.  That description above could include several private sector jobs I have had.  Weatherford - lost $700,000,000 USD in one year, and gave the CEO $7,000,000.   When they had issues, they would recycle management, rename departments and not address real issues.  They did that several times, each time thinking it was going to work.  

 

I used to work at a small public company.  One year we failed to turn a profit because of annual executive bonuses.  Had those bonuses not been granted, the company would have achieved an annual profit for the first time ever.  Hmmm.

1 hour ago, wildcat09 said:

Like what?

Like almost every time the content of the hacked emails were brought up and the media questioned certain aspects of those emails such as the Foundation or connections to Wall Street, her campaign deflected their contents by blaming the Russians and Trump.  And don't fucking but her emails me, you asked. 

Edited by Anastasis

2 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Like almost every time the content of the hacked emails were brought up and the media questioned certain aspects of those emails such as the Foundation or connections to Wall Street, her campaign deflected their contents by blaming the Russians.  And don't fucking but her emails me, you asked. 

Oh, you mean politics broke out? That's shocking coming from a presidential campaign. Way to crack the case.

25 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Maybe you suck dick down at the local grey hound station.

I'll have you know I work the Love's Gas Stations now.  I cater to interstate commercial transport.       

17 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

 Oh, you mean politics broke out? That's shocking coming from a presidential campaign. Way to crack the case.

I didn't make a big deal out of it actually. Wildcat  focused on the Clinton campaign specifically and asked the question.  I answered.  I am more interested in the intersection with the FBI and the intelligence apparatus. 

Edited by Anastasis

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