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Apparently humpback whales have been brawling with orcas for quite some time. A few days ago, 2 whales attacked about 2 dozen orcas up in the Pacific Northwest. Video in the link.

https://www.king5.com/article/tech/science/environment/orcas/clash-biggs-transient-orcas-humpback-whales-juan-de-fuca-strait/281-823125c0-2468-4c4e-a51b-432823537f10

Quote

Humpback whales clash with transient orcas in Strait of Juan de Fuca

The Pacific Whale Watch Association says the encounter lasted for hours before the groups of whales slipped out of view.

SEATTLE — Whale watchers witnessed a rare clash between a large group of Bigg’s orcas, also known as transient orcas, and two humpback whales this week, according to the Pacific Whale Watch Association. 

The incident began mid-morning on Sept. 29 in the Juan de Fuca Strait. Witnesses say the whales interacted for a few hours before they slipped out of sight.

Mollie Naccarato, captain and naturalist for Sooke Coastal Explorations on south Vancouver Island, was one of those who witnessed it.

“Even doing this every day, things like that just take your breath away and it's really something to marvel in," said Naccarato. 

She said she's grateful to spend time on the water and learn more about the whales every day. 

“They're just magnificent, so it's a lot of emotions, a lot of awareness, a lot of keeping everybody safe- ourselves and the animals, but it's truly breathtaking to witness something like that.”

Encounters between humpbacks and Bigg’s orcas are rare, essentially because Bigg’s orcas are predators to humpback calves. In some cases, though, humpbacks have fought back against orcas attempting to hunt calves or other prey.

“There have been a few occasions that our naturalists have actually seen humpback whales come to the rescue of other animals like sea lions that were being chased by orcas,” PWWA Executive Director Erin Johns Gless said.

Gless said it's more complex than orcas and humpbacks being adversaries. 

“But maybe it's, the enemy of my enemy is my friend," he said. "We've seen humpback whales actually chase orcas away that were trying to attack sea lions and the sea lions, of course, were very grateful.” 

Gless said in recent decades, the populations of both Bigg’s orcas and humpback whales have increased, in part because of laws prohibiting the hunting of marine mammals.

“We're seeing more orcas and we're seeing more humpbacks, so I wouldn't be surprised if we see more of these encounters of those two species together,” Gless said. 

 

 

 

I listened to a podcast a few months ago about other humpbacks mixing it up with orcas. Apparently humpback whales have long memories of themselves and/or others calves being attacked and will hold onto that grudge. They'll fight orcas even if it's not their fight to have. In the podcast, there's a story about humpback whales protecting a seal or sea lion by lifting it out of the ocean. 

https://radiolab.org/episodes/humpback-and-killer

 

 

An old article from National Geographic

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/animals/article/humpback-whales-save-animals-killer-whales-explained

Quote

In May 2012, researchers observed a pod of killer whales attacking a gray whale and its calf in Monterey Bay, California. After a struggle, the calf was killed. What happened next defies easy explanation.

Two humpback whales were already on the scene as the killer whales, or orcas, attacked the grays. But after the calf had been killed, about 14 more humpbacks arrived—seemingly to prevent the orcas from eating the calf.

“One specific humpback whale appeared to station itself next to that calf carcass, head pointed toward it, staying within a body length away, loudly vocalizing and tail slashing every time a killer whale came over to feed,” says Alisa Schulman-Janiger, a whale researcher with the California Killer Whale Project.

For six and a half hours, the humpbacks slashed at the killer whales with their flippers and tails. And despite thick swarms of krill spotted nearby—a favorite food for humpbacks—the giants did not abandon their vigil.

It’s not clear why the humpbacks would risk injury and waste so much energy protecting an entirely different species. What is clear is that this was not an isolated incident. In the last 62 years, there have been 115 interactions recorded between humpback whales and killer whales, according to a study published in July in the journal Marine Mammal Science.

“This humpback whale behavior continues to happen in multiple areas throughout the world,” says Schulman-Janiger, who coauthored the study.

“I have witnessed several encounters, but nothing as dramatic as [the May 2012 event],” she says. It remains the longest humpback-to-killer whale interaction known to date.

What Is Going on Here?

The most logical biological explanation for the humpbacks’ vigilante-like behavior is that the whales receive some sort of benefit from interfering with orca hunts.

For instance, orcas are known to attack humpbacks, and the whales are most vulnerable when they are young. Once fully grown, though, a single humpback is large enough to take on an entire pod of killer whales.

So perhaps the “rescuing” behavior has evolved as a way to help the species get through its weakest life stage, with humpbacks charging in when they think a young whale is at risk.

There’s also a good chance that the calf under attack is related to the whales coming to its rescue.

“Because humpbacks calves tend to return to the feeding and breeding grounds of their mothers, humpbacks in a given area tend to be more related to neighboring humpbacks than to the population as a whole,” says study leader Robert Pitman, a NOAA marine ecologist and National Geographic Society grant recipient.

But there’s a wrinkle in this explanation. Of all the incidents the scientists investigated over the last five decades, killer whales targeted humpbacks just 11 percent of the time. The other 89 percent involved orcas hunting seals, sea lions, porpoises, and other marine mammals.

There’s even one incident in which humpbacks apparently tried to save a pair of ocean sunfish from becoming orca hors d'oeuvres.

Perhaps it’s personal. Schulman-Janiger notes that not all humpbacks interfere with orca hunts, and many that do bear scars from being attacked by orcas earlier in their lives, perhaps as calves. Therefore, it’s possible that personal history drives humpbacks to respond to orca hunts.

The study also notes that it’s possible the humpbacks are responding to auditory calls made by the killer whales rather than the animals they are hunting. This would mean that the humpbacks don’t know what species is being attacked until they have already invested energy in swimming to the battle.

Such a behavior could persist in the population because it would occasionally benefit humpbacks—apparently enough to justify benefiting other species the majority of the time.

 

All for One, and One for All?

Other whale experts see a dose of something even more complex: altruism.

“Although this behavior is very interesting, I don’t find it completely surprising that a cetacean would intervene to help a member of another species,” says Lori Marino, an expert in cetacean intelligence and president of the Whale Sanctuary Project.

Humpbacks are capable of sophisticated thinking, decision-making, problem-solving, and communication, says Marino, who is also the executive director of the Kimmela Center for Animal Advocacy.

“So, taken altogether, these attributes are those of a species with a highly developed degree of general intelligence capable of empathic responses.”

 

Furthermore, humpbacks are not the only animals that seem to display some sort of regard for another species. Dolphins have been famously depicted as “aiding” dogs, whales, and perhaps even humans—though it should be noted that onlookers, not animal experts, often report such events, and it can be easy to misinterpret animal behavior.

Whether humpbacks are truly performing what amounts to a good deed or are benefiting from the process, it’s clear that we still have much to learn about the minds and motivations of the animals around us.

For the most part, Pitman says animals tend to do what is in their own best interest—even if the motivations themselves aren’t entirely clear to us.

“As biologists,” he says, “that is where we should start our search for explanations.”

 

Like orcas but they are like lions of the Serengeti. Humpback are kick ass if they are fucking with orcas just cause. That would be like elephants fucking with lions' kills to prevent the lions from eating the prey.

you’ll find jimmy hoffa before you find any humpback whales. 

How do they really know the sea lions are grateful?

9 minutes ago, Deej said:

How do they really know the sea lions are grateful?

 

7DE5D918-8FCE-479F-9BDD-FEAF686F1BDB.gif

8 hours ago, crash_davis said:

Like orcas but they are like lions of the Serengeti. Humpback are kick ass if they are fucking with orcas just cause. That would be like elephants fucking with lions' kills to prevent the lions from eating the prey.

I was going to go with mature, healthy Cape Buffalo will go out of their way to kill lions if they can get away with it (as will Elephants).

Edited by Bateshorn

6 hours ago, Post Oak said:

Orcas are dickheads.  Good for the humpbacks 

Assholes of the ocean. They will attack and tear up whale pups just to get their livers, then ignore the rest. 

 

Team Humpback!

 

Orcas are becoming bigger assholes. Attacking ships' rudders.

https://www.yachtingworld.com/cruising/orca-attacks-rudder-losses-and-damage-as-incidents-escalate-133968

Most concerning is the fact that the whales’ interactions with vessels appear to be not only more frequent, but also more sustained and involving a widening range of vessels.

“Last year it was mostly small sailing vessels, but this year they are going for larger sailing vessels and even catamarans, destroying both rudders. They also have been reported to go for fishing vessels and small RIBs, in southern Portugal, where the whale watching boats are mainly RIBs.

“They do go for them, but because there is no rudder, they just push the propellers and even push from the bottom of the boat. But it is kind of worrying because it looks like their behaviour is evolving.”

 

filmed attack.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4OdROXdGTM

 

This is just like the Jets and the Sharks, but in the water!

 

That eerie whale call noise is just them whistling to each other. 

 

 

 

7 hours ago, Deej said:

How do they really know the sea lions are grateful?

 

well, they don't show that on Mutual of Omaha's Wild Kingdom.

 

Edited by High Plains Drifter

  • Popular Post
1 hour ago, rage-a-holic said:

Assholes of the ocean. They will attack and tear up whale pups just to get their livers, then ignore the rest. 

 

 

nah, we are the assholes of the ocean:

 

gettyimages-661871012.jpg

 

16 hours ago, Superhero said:

transient orcas

Can we do away with the labels? The orcas have been through a lot. They just need a little time to get back on their feet. 

1 hour ago, rage-a-holic said:

Assholes of the ocean. They will attack and tear up whale pups just to get their livers, then ignore the rest. 

 

Hannibal Lecter, Fava Beans And Chianti GIF by The Livery of GIFs | Gfycat

17 hours ago, Superhero said:

Apparently humpback whales have been brawling with orcas for quite some time. A few days ago, 2 whales attacked about 2 dozen orcas up in the Pacific Northwest. Video in the link.

https://www.king5.com/article/tech/science/environment/orcas/clash-biggs-transient-orcas-humpback-whales-juan-de-fuca-strait/281-823125c0-2468-4c4e-a51b-432823537f10

 

Thie first thing in that video is a fat chick that exclaims "I love whales!". I bet you do, honey.

17 hours ago, Superhero said:

Apparently humpback whales have been brawling with orcas for quite some time. A few days ago, 2 whales attacked about 2 dozen orcas up in the Pacific Northwest. Video in the link.

https://www.king5.com/article/tech/science/environment/orcas/clash-biggs-transient-orcas-humpback-whales-juan-de-fuca-strait/281-823125c0-2468-4c4e-a51b-432823537f10

 

hydra and reaper are some bad ass names for some bad ass whales

edit: valiant too.  almost like british ship names

Edited by elfenix

  • Popular Post
16 hours ago, Not a cat said:

I would have bet anything that nothing fucks with orcas.

@Vic Mackey

2 hours ago, rage-a-holic said:

Assholes of the ocean. They will attack and tear up whale pups just to get their livers, then ignore the rest. 

 

So what? They're predators lmao

Do you think the rest of those carcasses just go to waste?

7 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

So what? They're predators lmao

Do you think the rest of those carcasses just go to waste?

No shit? They're predators? Thanks for the heads up, fuckface.

No one was arguing against whatever point you're trying to make.

Orcas do a lot of cruel shit for fun; whale pup livers don't contain a magical substance Orcas need to survive.

If you shoot Bambi just to get some liver, you're an asshole too.

Just now, rage-a-holic said:

No shit? They're predators? Thanks for the heads up, fuckface.

No one was arguing against whatever point you're trying to make.

Orcas do a lot of cruel shit for fun; whale pup livers don't contain a magical substance Orcas need to survive.

If you shoot Bambi just to get some liver, you're an asshole too.

Didn't mean to be confrontational.

Yeah it seems that a consequence of high levels of intelligence is that sometimes cruelty comes into play. That's a big reason why most of them go insane in captivity I guess.

A lot of predators kill just for liver, though, they're highly desirable from a nutritional standpoint. It's not like the animal is going to waste, something is gonna eat the rest. 

4 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

Didn't mean to be confrontational.

Yeah it seems that a consequence of high levels of intelligence is that sometimes cruelty comes into play. That's a big reason why most of them go insane in captivity I guess.

A lot of predators kill just for liver, though, they're highly desirable from a nutritional standpoint. It's not like the animal is going to waste, something is gonna eat the rest. 

I get that, but Orcas will also sometimes just eat the tongue or other random organs. The "asshole" part comes up because many of the calve attacks involve toying with it and needlessly torturing it before the actual kill.

NOTE: I know plenty of marine biologists in Baja/Yucatan who love whales and detest orcas due to this behavior. If you get stuck on a long boat ride with them, they end up swapping "asshole orca" stories.

I was in South Africa the week two great whites washed up on the local beaches, killed by orcas who took them out via the liver.  We went shark cage diving that week, and saw a few up close and personal, but it’s my understanding that since the orcas dropped a couple of body bags, the great whites left and haven’t returned.  It’s had a large impact on the little town where great white sharks were their primary business.  Team humpback.

The "asshole" part comes up because many of the calve attacks involve toying with it and needlessly torturing it before the actual kill.


So, orcas are the cats of the ocean.
1 minute ago, CooterBrown said:

 


So, orcas are the cats of the ocean.

 

And cats are the assholes of the household pet kingdom

yep, orcas are assholes

 

Edited by mchookem

1 hour ago, rage-a-holic said:

NOTE: I know plenty of marine biologists in Baja/Yucatan who love whales and detest orcas due to this behavior. If you get stuck on a long boat ride with them, they end up swapping "asshole orca" stories.

Name six of the female marine biologists and then provide pics and tell us why they hate assholes.

Orcas are awesome.  Just remember that they’ll fuck with whales and fuck with seals and torture their prey but if you fall off a boat they will be cool to you, because they know you’re a human and they’re cool with humans.  The apex predator of the ocean just wants to be our buddy.  It doesn’t get more awesome than that. 

3 hours ago, rage-a-holic said:

I get that, but Orcas will also sometimes just eat the tongue or other random organs. The "asshole" part comes up because many of the calve attacks involve toying with it and needlessly torturing it before the actual kill.

NOTE: I know plenty of marine biologists in Baja/Yucatan who love whales and detest orcas due to this behavior. If you get stuck on a long boat ride with them, they end up swapping "asshole orca" stories.

After mating, the female praying mantis will often kill and eat the male. Top that.

Big fan of both orcas and the whales, but they need to work things out amongst themselves.  Maybe bring in Flipper as a peace negotiator.

2624e0b8a589522d9af523ae35879993aa9187f5

16 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

After mating, the female praying mantis will often kill and eat the male. Top that.

After mating, the female human will often make the male marry them.  Top that!

3 hours ago, futureman said:

Orcas are awesome.  Just remember that they’ll fuck with whales and fuck with seals and torture their prey but if you fall off a boat they will be cool to you, because they know you’re a human and they’re cool with humans.  The apex predator of the ocean just wants to be our buddy.  It doesn’t get more awesome than that. 

They've been known to protect humans from sharks as well, though that's not unique to them, many different species of whales/dolphins have done similar things.

The difference in their demeanor toward humans between captive and wild orcas is almost unbelievable, it's like two entirely different animals.

If you really want to hate humanity, go watch Blackfish. The fact that we're still allowed to keep them in captivity is a travesty.

5 hours ago, rage-a-holic said:

NOTE: I know plenty of marine biologists in Baja/Yucatan who love whales and detest orcas due to this behavior. If you get stuck on a long boat ride with them, they end up swapping "asshole orca" stories.

yeah but can they top this...

 

FormalOnlyGrebe-size_restricted.gif

Edited by mchookem

3 hours ago, mchookem said:

yep, orcas are assholes

I dunno Steve Irwin probably approves of this move.

1 hour ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

Maybe bring in Flipper as a peace negotiator.

bnKe4h.gif

Big fan of both orcas and the whales, but they need to work things out amongst themselves.  Maybe bring in Flipper as a peace negotiator.
2624e0b8a589522d9af523ae35879993aa9187f570c98dbc70d1884efab14c6b.jpg
I've seen flipper fucking with it's food plenty in the wild. Just chucking around trout and flounder like "fuck yo couch". * So maybe not the best negotiator to send.


*They appeared to be perhaps training thier young while doing this, but with a bit of unnecessary torture.

** Gen xer, it's okay to eat fish, they don't have any feelings.
After mating, the female human will often make the male marry them.  Top that!
Then take half his shit and try and make coparenting as hard as possible for 13 years. I'd almost prefer the Orca.
They've been known to protect humans from sharks as well, though that's not unique to them, many different species of whales/dolphins have done similar things.
The difference in their demeanor toward humans between captive and wild orcas is almost unbelievable, it's like two entirely different animals.
If you really want to hate humanity, go watch Blackfish. The fact that we're still allowed to keep them in captivity is a travesty.
Agreed. Growing up I wanted to be a marine biologist. I could see myself volunteering in Monterey Bay when I'm old.
2 hours ago, Brian Fantana said:

They've been known to protect humans from sharks as well, though that's not unique to them, many different species of whales/dolphins have done similar things.

The difference in their demeanor toward humans between captive and wild orcas is almost unbelievable, it's like two entirely different animals.

If you really want to hate humanity, go watch Blackfish. The fact that we're still allowed to keep them in captivity is a travesty.

I have never heard of the protection thing. Wormhole time

5 hours ago, Zepol87 said:

I have never heard of the protection thing. Wormhole time

Dolphins saved my grandfather’s life when he went for a 2 day swim in the Pacific during WWII.  They ran off the sharks. 

14 hours ago, rage-a-holic said:

No shit? They're predators? Thanks for the heads up, fuckface.

No one was arguing against whatever point you're trying to make.

Orcas do a lot of cruel shit for fun; whale pup livers don't contain a magical substance Orcas need to survive.

If you shoot Bambi just to get some liver, you're an asshole too.

such an odd rant.  Many predators eat only the most fatty and/or nutritious part of their prey and leave the rest.  One example: bears

https://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=brownbear.trivia

 

Bears use the most nutritious parts of their food to maximize their weight gain. Grass and forbs are only used while they are rapidly growing in the spring and early summer. Brains, flesh and eggs are preferred parts of the salmon. Internal organs of deer, elk and cattle are eaten first when one is killed or scavenged.

 

People putting human "morals" onto animals is so fucking weird to me. 

 

And, as pointed out above, Orcas might be assholes to our boats but I don't think there's a single example of them attacking a human in the wild.  (yes, I'm very aware of the Sea World attacks...FAFO)

Edited by DigglerontheHoof

10 minutes ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

such an odd rant.  Many predators eat only the most fatty and/or nutritious part of their prey and leave the rest.  One example: bears

https://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=brownbear.trivia

 

Bears use the most nutritious parts of their food to maximize their weight gain. Grass and forbs are only used while they are rapidly growing in the spring and early summer. Brains, flesh and eggs are preferred parts of the salmon. Internal organs of deer, elk and cattle are eaten first when one is killed or scavenged.

 

People putting human "morals" onto animals is so fucking weird to me. 

 

And, as pointed out above, Orcas might be assholes to our boats but I don't think there's a single example of them attacking a human in the wild.  (yes, I'm very aware of the Sea World attacks...FAFO)

They attack rudders on sail boats. I'd say leaving a sailboat rudderless in the open sea counts as an attack on humans.

16 minutes ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

People putting human "morals" onto animals is so fucking weird to me.

Humans are the biggest assholes of all species. 

13 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

They attack rudders on sail boats. I'd say leaving a sailboat rudderless in the open sea counts as an attack on humans.

Perhaps, I'm not whale mind-reader but I'm not sure they comprehend the concept of disabling a boat as attacking a human.   If so, I'd think attacking a human swimming would be a much more satisfying target...and there are no examples I know of that happening. 

7 hours ago, Born to Run said:

Growing up I wanted to be a marine biologist.

YARN | Is anyone here a marine biologist? | Seinfeld (1993) - S05E14 The Marine  Biologist | Video gifs by quotes | 759ad208 | 紗

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