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The Leopards Eating Faces and Unlubed Dildo of Consequences Thread

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10 hours ago, The Original Greaser Bob said:

I waw not able to download the first link, but the only article that even pretended to be an academic paper rendered this conclusion: 

Conclusions and implications.  This study concludes that the majority of the sample companies have publicly stated diversity- related value statements. This suggests that companies have started to realise the importance of emphasising diversity related values. This study also concludes that diversity-related value statements are positively correlated with the financial performance of the sample companies, although their correlation is not statistically significant.

Which basically says that companies who trumpet diversity and talk the talk may have had positive financial performance.  Maybe.  Which isn't even the question I posed, which was how DEI programs have actually had positive diversity and inclusion EFFECTS.

And companies can still trumpet their commitment to these values today.  Which again, doesn't answer the questions as to whether the programs themselves are of value or more importantly whether programs aimed at economic disadvantage would have a more positive effect.  

This study highlights things that work and that aren't a problem under the EOs - mentorship programs and targeted recruiting (yes, you will have to recruit at Georgetown if you are going to recruit at Howard in order to cover your ass - but that's just good business.).  But you can get actual results without being bogged down by the nomenclature.

Why Diversity Programs Fail

This kinda puffy piece identifies the problem with the puff pieces you linked to.  The data just isn't there that goes beyond the intuitive and real conclusion that diversity is good, and actually shows the results that DEI programs have achieved.    The end of the article points wo how companies who are interested in diversity equity can do a lot more than lip service in terms of actually getting results. 

Are Diversity Programs Doomed—Or Ready for a Revamp?

Although people are spending lots of time criticizing companies for editing their DEI-ish marketing language, in reality I think a lot of those companies behind the scenes are pretty pissed off and actually, finally, thinking of ways to go beyond the marketing. 

The first article had several links associated with it, including peer reviewed articles.  I am not sure why you glossed over that.  For example, one links to another, which cites the source as a 2022 paper in the Journal of Academy of Management, (abstract).   Another is written by BCG and another by McKinsey, and while not up to the peer reviewed standard, they operate in this segment and have some expertise.   The analog would be similar to listening to Dr. Offit or Fauci about their recommendation on how to navigate a pandemic with a novel virus without having direct expertise on the matter.  Sure it is an appeal to authority to some degree, but that authority has credentials.   And being a lawyer, you often cite cases which is just the opinion of some subjective people, not exactly a higher standard.  Heck, so many of them are wrong but they just defer to the other guy who said something.  Your SCOTUS is littered with historical idiocy and corruption. 

BTW I knew you you latch on to that one.  IIRC, the issue was that the study didn't differentiate between DEI as a platitude and DEI as a company culture commitment which in one of the other sources linked, discussed this aspect in greater detail.  And yet, they still found to some degree a positive correlation, had they had a slightly more robust study, they would have segmented the data into categories and then analyzed it and included the statistical output so we could see the null hypothesis results.   

The diversity programs failing HBR is a little dated and narrow in its focus.  While it is true the video for new employees and subsequent testing method is not a great initiative and does little to impact the culture of an organization, that doesn't mean that a cultural change within the organization will have the same impact. The interesting aspect of that article was the lawsuits paid out for harassment claims, and they should have looked into the rates in which those maintained, increased or decreased through time and awareness.   What are included in the previous links are surveys on employee engagement, reduction in turnover, financial performance gains, some of which is linked to expansion into new markets based on diversity.  Of course this could also be bad, if they just know better neighborhoods to dump toxic chemicals into.     

 

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14 hours ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

 

 

I'm being a little hypocritical because I do watch the Bulwark (Sarah Longwell's thing) on Youtube but I still cringe up every time on her, George Conway, Tim Miller et al yoking up it about Trump and MAGA.   Sure, it's nice to see some come to their senses and leave that world but they also had a significant hand in making it that way.

2 hours ago, Macanudo said:

I'm being a little hypocritical because I do watch the Bulwark (Sarah Longwell's thing) on Youtube but I still cringe up every time on her, George Conway, Tim Miller et al yoking up it about Trump and MAGA.   Sure, it's nice to see some come to their senses and leave that world but they also had a significant hand in making it that way.

It's weird. By the way they talk they sound progressive, but they spent years of their lives getting ghouls like GWB and Reagan elected and trying to get people like Romney in. Yet the politics of those people are incongruent with what they say now on the Bulwark. So either they realized they were being stupid before and changed, or they were just being stupid before and never realized they were supporting this nonsense. 

Tim Miller doesn’t call himself a Democrat but pretty completely repudiates all of the positions he previously held as a Republican (or rather, mocks them).  
 

I think they are more interested in taking down the Emperor than figuring out where they lie currently on a left-right spectrum, and I’m fine with that.  

17 minutes ago, LCHorn said:

Tim Miller doesn’t call himself a Democrat but pretty completely repudiates all of the positions he previously held as a Republican (or rather, mocks them).  
 

I think they are more interested in taking down the Emperor than figuring out where they lie currently on a left-right spectrum, and I’m fine with that.  

To me, it’s a matter of degree.  If you have a core belief that business and our economy doing well as what’s best for the country and the source of the continued health of our democracy and nation, then you can reconcile yourself with GOP policies that may have hurt the little guy to some extent if it led to a robust economy.   If you view a good economy as the key to all good things in our country, you can surely overlook individual instances where people on the low economic end of the spectrum (here, read minorities ) take a hit from some of the policies.

That is completely different to seeing millions of undocumented immigrants who are good neighbors contributing to the economy and helping that precious economy being treated like criminals, regardless of their being in the country for decades, not causing any harm, but helping out established businesses in many industries that require undocumented labor because citizen white people don’t want to do it - then the combination of the assault on the economy and the destruction of many industries, combined with horrific human suffering on a bunch of people in a scale exceeding what you were willing to put up with previously would lead a rock rib,old school republican to turn on the current guys.

I always consider myself the last Rockefeller Republican on earth, and thought that conservative business models combined with progressive social issues was the way to go.  As long as that business  model  was not bullshit trickle down.    Which is all to say - I could see how those guys came from where they were to where they are.

27 minutes ago, LCHorn said:

Tim Miller doesn’t call himself a Democrat but pretty completely repudiates all of the positions he previously held as a Republican (or rather, mocks them).  
 

I think they are more interested in taking down the Emperor than figuring out where they lie currently on a left-right spectrum, and I’m fine with that.  

I think that's me.  I'm certainly more sympathetic to social issues than I have ever been, and accordingly more willing to spend (and tax) to deal with them.  I'm also mostly done with "small government."

But if and when a conservative party emerges that has nothing to do with the shitheap that is Trumpism and sycophants, I might find myself there.  I don't know anymore.

1 hour ago, TwiceHorn said:

But if and when a conservative party emerges that has nothing to do with the shitheap that is Trumpism and sycophants, I might find myself there.  I don't know anymore.

 

I don't believe that will ever happen.    

You would need a situation like Germany at the conclusion of WWII to get a political party to completely repudiate everything they stand for. Because gerrymandering will ensure that today's GOP will still remain a political force for years to come,  no matter how repulsive they become.

 

 

On 5/30/2025 at 3:17 PM, Brisketexan said:

some of the most enthusiastic Scottish nationalists.....are sikhs wearing madras

Relatable!

1 hour ago, LCHorn said:

think they are more interested in taking down the Emperor than figuring out where they lie currently on a left-right spectrum, and I’m fine with that.  

For the record I am 100% more interested in saving the republic than places on the left-right spectrum. 

Edited by Bozo_Casanova

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17 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

I'm certainly more sympathetic to social issues than I have ever been, and accordingly more willing to spend (and tax) to deal with them.  I'm also mostly done with "small government."

I appreciate the self-reflection here. I've had a very, very similar conversation with my dad several times (who voted Trump in '16, and had repudiated him by about March of 2017). Conservatives haven't ACTUALLY been about small government, either fiscally or government-control related, in a very long time. Democrats may spend more in terms of "absolute dollars allocated," but tax rates have consistently come down over the decades, tax programs at least try and target those who can afford to pay, and those dollars are consistently invested in programs with a very high ROI; see the resultant economic indicators at the end of any D president in the last 50 years. 

 

Small government is a dog-whistle for "the rich get richer." Effective government that looks out for every American (not just a talking point) is squarely in the province of the Dems. I wish more people would just vote their conscience.

3 minutes ago, capnamerca said:

I wish more people would just vote their conscience.

The problem is that people do vote their conscience. 

2 minutes ago, royiv said:

The problem is that people do vote their conscience. 

Thanks, I hate it. :(

20 hours ago, LCHorn said:

Tim Miller doesn’t call himself a Democrat but pretty completely repudiates all of the positions he previously held as a Republican (or rather, mocks them).  
 

I think they are more interested in taking down the Emperor than figuring out where they lie currently on a left-right spectrum, and I’m fine with that.  

Miller and Longwell are both gay and yet belong to that group of LGBTQ voters that actively worked and campaigned for people who, at a mimimum, want them considered 2nd class citizens and, worst case, actually persecuted.  

11 minutes ago, Macanudo said:

Miller and Longwell are both gay and yet belong to that group of LGBTQ voters that actively worked and campaigned for people who, at a mimimum, want them considered 2nd class citizens and, worst case, actually persecuted.  

I mean, add them to the long list of people who set their voting priorities by something different from what we might presume they should be. 

I do think the bitter gay ex-Republican faction, however minute it might be, is my favorite.  I know a couple personally and they are far more fun socially than my died in the wool Dem friends. 

19 hours ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

 

I don't believe that will ever happen.    

You would need a situation like Germany at the conclusion of WWII to get a political party to completely repudiate everything they stand for. Because gerrymandering will ensure that today's GOP will still remain a political force for years to come,  no matter how repulsive they become.

 

 

You very well may be right.  It's just my nature to kind of "move carefully."  I don't ever want to go backward, usually, but I think massive, expensive leaps "forward" may not be as good as they sound.  And I'm very much for human and civil rights and think when those clash with religion, in most cases religion should yield.

13 hours ago, LCHorn said:

I mean, add them to the long list of people who set their voting priorities by something different from what we might presume they should be. 

I do think the bitter gay ex-Republican faction, however minute it might be, is my favorite.  I know a couple personally and they are far more fun socially than my died in the wool Dem friends. 

Unless you’re comparing them to the gay Dems you know, I think it’s the gay part and not the ex-Republican part that makes them fun to hang out with socially. Not entirely, because there’s a lot of diversity in the gay community just as in any other, but in my experience gay folks are generally pretty fun to party with. But I can’t say I’ve ever hung out with a gay Republican, current or former (afaik).

Unless you’re comparing them to the gay Dems you know, I think it’s the gay part and not the ex-Republican part that makes them fun to hang out with socially. Not entirely, because there’s a lot of diversity in the gay community just as in any other, but in my experience gay folks are generally pretty fun to party with. But I can’t say I’ve ever hung out with a gay Republican, current or former (afaik).

I have and it was really strange. He had pictures with GW Bush and had some autographed stuff from Bush Sr. He lives in Towne Lake, so the politics sorta track.

Who knows where they would end up if Maga is defeated, but Tim and Bill Kristol have shockingly been more on the pulse regarding the grotesque deportations (and frankly many other issues) than most of the Dem leaders have. They are podcast hosts so very different stakes involved, but it’s a bit disheartening that former neocons are more passionate leaders on these issues than many true-blue dems.

I do think Tim and Bill pretty frequently  castigate themselves over their wrongly-held prior beliefs. Sarah less so.

On 5/31/2025 at 7:08 PM, LCHorn said:

Tim Miller doesn’t call himself a Democrat but pretty completely repudiates all of the positions he previously held as a Republican (or rather, mocks them).  
 

I think they are more interested in taking down the Emperor than figuring out where they lie currently on a left-right spectrum, and I’m fine with that.  

They’re interested in making money. That’s all that can be said with any certainty. You and others above your post in this thread point out the total reversal of their policy positions. They know their audience. That’s all. Bulwark, Meidas, Bluesky/tiktok influencers, Lincoln Project hacks, none of these people likely believe much of anything they say. They’re just grifting on the right side for now.

Fuck the lot of them. 

9 minutes ago, softlynow said:

They’re interested in making money. That’s all that can be said with any certainty. You and others above your post in this thread point out the total reversal of their policy positions. They know their audience. That’s all. Bulwark, Meidas, Bluesky/tiktok influencers, Lincoln Project hacks, none of these people likely believe much of anything they say. They’re just grifting on the right side for now.

Fuck the lot of them. 

Yeah, I disagree.   Far more money to be made as a member of the MAGA media ecosystem. 

They basically have a media company built for Goldwater Republicans and that's an increasingly small piece of the listening audience (also, OLD!).

22 minutes ago, softlynow said:

They’re interested in making money. That’s all that can be said with any certainty. You and others above your post in this thread point out the total reversal of their policy positions. They know their audience. That’s all. Bulwark, Meidas, Bluesky/tiktok influencers, Lincoln Project hacks, none of these people likely believe much of anything they say. They’re just grifting on the right side for now.

Fuck the lot of them. 

This is really cynical, and I'm here for it. 

This bleeds all the way to the far left. Engagement is all that matters. I think Sam Seder is a good man with a lot of good opinions, but the Majority Report makes their money by posting videos making fun of and "owning" right wing media/podcasters. In the end all this shit is completely worthless and unhelpful. Everything is broken. 

 

So where are the leopard posts? I miss those.

1 hour ago, Hank Kingsley said:

This is really cynical, and I'm here for it. 

This bleeds all the way to the far left. Engagement is all that matters. I think Sam Seder is a good man with a lot of good opinions, but the Majority Report makes their money by posting videos making fun of and "owning" right wing media/podcasters. In the end all this shit is completely worthless and unhelpful. Everything is broken. 

 

In the "we want a reasoned discussion of policy and a functioning government" sense, you're absolutely right.

But as long as nearly half the country is going to be engaged politically only by "pwnage" and sound bites, they're absolutely necessary.

 

7 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

But as long as nearly half the country is going to be engaged politically only by "pwnage" and sound bites, they're absolutely necessary.

But the right will always win that war. When a large group abandons good faith and takes on trolling as a literal and primary personality trait, you're never gonna defeat them with pwnage or soundbites. That game is rigged. We have to find another way. 

 

2 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

But the right will always win that war. When a large group abandons good faith and takes on trolling as a literal and primary personality trait, you're never gonna defeat them with pwnage or soundbites. That game is rigged. We have to find another way. 

 

Maybe so, but I think there's something of a middle that's reachable that is currently coopted by the Rogan/Von brocast thing.  Bozo is right a lot of the time and I think he may be right on this, that "we" can't wholly abandon the field to these clods.

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Maybe so, but I think there's something of a middle that's reachable that is currently coopted by the Rogan/Von brocast thing.  Bozo is right a lot of the time and I think he may be right on this, that "we" can't wholly abandon the field to these clods.

Agree with this! Those are good faith attempts to reach people on the right. All for it. 

 

Unless you’re comparing them to the gay Dems you know, I think it’s the gay part and not the ex-Republican part that makes them fun to hang out with socially. Not entirely, because there’s a lot of diversity in the gay community just as in any other, but in my experience gay folks are generally pretty fun to party with. But I can’t say I’ve ever hung out with a gay Republican, current or former (afaik).

Patton Oswalt had a set where we wanted to be cast as the boring, stupid gay friend in a 2000’s RomCom
21 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

But the right will always win that war. When a large group abandons good faith and takes on trolling as a literal and primary personality trait, you're never gonna defeat them with pwnage or soundbites. That game is rigged. We have to find another way. 

Yes and no.  

The current information ecosystem prizes nothing as highly as it does stupidity, soundbites, trolling, and outright fucking lies.  You cannot succeed WITHOUT that component.

But I agree, the opposition voting base is not as susceptible to those things across the board, so you ALSO need, you know.....facts, truth, and logical reasoning.  A one-two punch.  Which will be two wildly different messages selling the same thing, but that's marketing, people.  Like selling a luxury sportscar:

Advertisement to people who read the Economist: "A luxury ride, with rich Corinthian leather, and the acceleration that the discriminating and skilled driver prefers."

Advertisement to people who get their news from TikTok: "It makes awesome 'VROOM VROOM' noises!  It goes super fast!  Look at this video of a chick with big tits riding shotgun on a racetrack, with them tig ole biddies bouncing around!"

You can sell the same car to both audiences.*  We just have to get over ourselves and start speaking fluent VROOM VROOM AND TIG OLE BIDDIES and such, metaphorically speaking.

 

* Note: both advertising styles will work on Surly posters.

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3 hours ago, Nivek said:

So where are the leopard posts? I miss those.


Getting this motherfucker back on track


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8 hours ago, Goofyboy said:

He lives in Towne Lake, so the politics sorta track.

1.  What the hell is Towne Lake?

2. Is it Old Gregg?

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You’ve had the hat for 10 years. You’ve had the presidency for nearly 5 of the last 10. So… why isn’t America great yet?
You keep chanting “Make America Great Again.” But let’s audit what you’ve actually done with that time, money, and energy.

THE TIME DRAIN: A NATION OF WASTED HOURS

Let’s break it down:
Rallies
• Avg rally time (travel, standing in line, event): 8 hours
• Avg engaged supporter: 2 rallies/year
• Core base: ~10 million people

8 hrs × 2 rallies × 10M = 160 million hours/year

That’s:
• 18,250 years of productive human time per year
• Enough to build 50,000 houses annually
• Mentor 1.6 million teens weekly
• Earn 3.2 million college degrees

Right-Wing Media Obsession
• MAGA-heavy viewers spend 15+ hours/week watching Fox, Newsmax, OAN, etc.
(source: Nielsen + Pew Research)
• That’s 780 hours/year, or 32 full days

The average American watches much less political content (approx. 2–4 hrs/week), and consumes a mix of topics. MAGA viewers, meanwhile, are trapped in an endless loop of rage-farming.

Social Media Screaming
• MAGA users spend 25% more time on Facebook than the average American
(Meta internal data leaks show political rage is the #1 engagement driver)
• They’re significantly more likely to post, share, argue, and consume political content instead of, say, learning skills, earning money, or helping their communities.

THE MONEY DUMP: FLAGS, HATS, SCAMS, & GRIFTS

• Avg MAGA follower spends $300–$1,000/year on Trump gear, “Let’s Go Brandon” junk, political merch, livestream donations, NFT scams, Trump steaks, etc.
• Conservatively: $500/year × 10M supporters = $5 billion/year

That’s:
• 2.5 million community college scholarships
• 40 million school lunches/week
• Housing for 300,000 veterans
• Dozens of hospitals in rural America
• Or—hell—even basic infrastructure in your own towns

Instead? You bought a 3rd flag for your truck.

THE ATTENTION SUCK: MINDSPACE YOU NEVER GET BACK

You had:
• A decade to develop a skill
• A decade to help a neighbor
• A decade to serve your community
• A decade to build something

But instead, you screamed into Facebook threads, got worked up over drag queens and gas stoves, and donated to millionaires pretending to be victims.

Patriotism Isn’t Performance. It’s Purpose.

You’ve had:
• The hat
• The power
• The time
• The money

But what did you build?
The most anti-American thing you can do is waste America.
You were born with rights people die for—and you spent them on merch, memes, and messiah complexes.

It’s not the immigrants.
It’s not the media.
It’s not the deep state.
It’s what you did with the gift of living here.
Maybe instead of buying another hat, you should’ve bought:
• A shovel
• A book
• A therapy session
• A community garden kit
• A ticket to a city council meeting

Because freedom is wasted if it’s only used to scream and shop.

46 minutes ago, GenXer said:


Getting this motherfucker back on track


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That's a weird handshake...looks more like he's trying to get the wadded up $20 out of Thiel's hand. 

1.  What the hell is Towne Lake?
2. Is it Old Gregg?

Neighborhood in Cypress off 290 and Barker Cypress. They turned their detention ponds into ski lakes and crammed $1M homes on the water. Super MAGA neighborhood. I mean, not as MAGA as mine where gov wheels did his bullshit door knocking, but still really MAGA.
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Not all that surprising, considering we eventually learn that most tech billionaires are assholes, but did no one think to point out that "Palantir" is a reference to a Tolkien magical artifact that was used by the most evil being in that world to corrupt the mind of a would-be adversary and to spy on the good guys? Just another case of evil always self-reports, I guess.

Yeah, yeah, fuckin' nerd.

Tim Miller doesn’t call himself a Democrat but pretty completely repudiates all of the positions he previously held as a Republican (or rather, mocks them).  
 
I think they are more interested in taking down the Emperor than figuring out where they lie currently on a left-right spectrum, and I’m fine with that.  
I have no doubt some of them will come back to the GOP after Trump is gone. Miller probably stays on the left, though. Being gay doesn't fit with today's GOP.
28 minutes ago, softlynow said:

Yeah, yeah, fuckin' nerd.

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On 5/9/2025 at 11:29 AM, GenXer said:


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firm spokesperson weighs in

 

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Firm spokesperson unavailable for comment 

 

3 hours ago, The Original Greaser Bob said:

Yep.

Congrats on being a bigot, I guess?

24 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

An exit email is such a brave stand. 

Do you ever post something substantive that you have to defend with logic and data? 

 

Nevermind, I know the answer.

Just now, capnamerca said:

Do you ever post something substantive that you have to defend with logic and data? 

 

Nevermind, I know the answer.

All the time. In real life and here. Probably higher standards than exit emails. Not sure why that triggered you. 

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Just now, Anastasis said:

All the time. In real life and here. Probably higher standards than exit emails. Not sure why that triggered you. 

Possibly because the exit emails weren't actually the point, but rather the EXITS THEMSELVES are the point. I'm damn proud of the lawyers that left the firms who bent the knee to Trump, because they're standing on the principle of law and of the separation of powers. 

18 minutes ago, capnamerca said:

Possibly because the exit emails weren't actually the point, but rather the EXITS THEMSELVES are the point. I'm damn proud of the lawyers that left the firms who bent the knee to Trump, because they're standing on the principle of law and of the separation of powers. 

Sounds like it hits close to home. Sorry I guess that a ny law firm is taking some hits. 

22 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

All the time. In real life and here. Probably higher standards than exit emails. Not sure why that triggered you. 

🤡

I guess it is probably better than an exit social media post. 

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

I guess it is probably better than an exit social media post. 

I'm legitimately curious as to what you get out of all of this? Not in terms of social structure or global gains ... you, specifically. How are you better after all of this? Do you think you're making valid points? You don't seem to want to debate policy. You aren't raising counterpoints to the dominant narrative in these parts. You don't seem to have an opinion of your own or even a voice, really. You just seem to live on the margins, throwing barbs when it suits you and disappearing as soon as the conversation goes one click below surface level. 

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6 hours ago, capnamerca said:

I'm legitimately curious as to what you get out of all of this? Not in terms of social structure or global gains ... you, specifically. How are you better after all of this? Do you think you're making valid points? You don't seem to want to debate policy. You aren't raising counterpoints to the dominant narrative in these parts. You don't seem to have an opinion of your own or even a voice, really. You just seem to live on the margins, throwing barbs when it suits you and disappearing as soon as the conversation goes one click below surface level. 

What you're doing right now is what he gets out of it. He's a contrarian troll that enjoys disagreeing and getting people spun up. 

There's a reason he works in the death panel industry

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