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  • best comment i read so far about the contract length.   "There are Phillies fans not yet born that will be throwing batteries at him in the later years of this contract".

  • From Levi Weaver's column in The Athletic:  

  • Gammons rambles way too much and it's like his editors are afraid to touch his work, but I like him because he loves baseball.  Not just MLB.  Gammons loves BASEBALL. And he hit this one out of t

8 hours ago, patrickdrinksbeer said:


yeah, that was not thinly veiled sarcasm

OK, here's Ken Rosenthal from Feb 1 of this year. My point is if the Dodgers were willing to do a mega deal, why not get in on Harper earlier? It's rare to see a team totally change course in late February. So this might just be a Boras ploy to raise the Phillies price. I also think he'd be OK with Philly but his family really wants to get him west.

Quote

Teams, though, do not simply want to get below the threshold one time. Dodgers president Stan Kasten, in an interview with the Los Angeles Times’ Dylan Hernandez, said: “If we can do whatever we do and stay under, there are a lot of advantages to being under — by the way, a lot more advantages than you all write about . . . I’m not going to go into that because that’s real inside baseball economic stuff.”

Kasten wasn’t only referring to the taxes and surtaxes teams face for exceeding the three tiers of the threshold, or the loss of 10 spots in the draft order for going $40 million over. Other parts of the collective bargaining agreement also figure into the equation, though typically in less meaningful fashion.

If a big-market team such as the Dodgers exceeds the threshold for at least two consecutive years, it forfeits a percentage of the revenue-sharing refund it would otherwise receive. Teams also must remain in compliance with the debt-service rule, earning enough profits to adequately service their debt.

 

Edited by Bartles
Link added

 

my guess is that boras made it known that they weren’t listening to anything less than 8 years, but now that they haven’t gotten those offers, the dodgers feel like they have a shot on a shorter, higher AAV offer.
14 hours ago, TheFlagship said:

Cespedes but then he got Mets’d. The Dodgers have plenty of money they shouldn’t worry about luxury tax 

Good call on Cespedes, who is repped by Roc Nation. He signed for 3/75 in 2016 and for one year, both sides were thrilled with it. So before 2017, they made it 4/110 and that has been a disaster. Mets have to sit there while he gobbles up payroll, YC has to worry about his long term prospects. Of course injuries are unpredictable, but have to figure Harper and the Dodgers have reasons not to do a high dollar, short term deal.

It's probably obvious I'm trying to talk myself into Harper/Phillies still happening. But if he and his family are dead set on going west (or Yankees), so be it. 

Also possible the Dodgers could feel threatened by San Diego now, at least long term. Plus with Arenado signing his extension, there won’t be many upgrades in the FA market next offseason, so it makes sense to pony up for Harper now.

Teams, though, do not simply want to get below the threshold one time. Dodgers president Stan Kasten, in an interview with the Los Angeles Times’ Dylan Hernandez, said: “If we can do whatever we do and stay under, there are a lot of advantages to being under — by the way, a lot more advantages than you all write about . . . I’m not going to go into that because that’s real inside baseball economic stuff.”

i'm a big fan of the expression "inside baseball" and use it from time to time.  that said, this is the first time i think it's ever been used to describe something actually related to baseball.

Harper doesn't seem like the kind of guy that would give a shit what his family thinks, but guess that's just on-field persona.

Are guys worried about the market after the new labor agreement, and are looking to get as many years under contract after it as possible before the strike/lockout and eventual new deal?

13 years 330 million.

Boras’d

Edited by TheFlagship

14 minutes ago, TheFlagship said:

13 years 330 million.

Boras’d

Good for him.

I can't wait to hear how things are going for the Phillies in year eight.

16 minutes ago, TheFlagship said:

13 years 330 million.

Boras’d

giphy.gif

1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

Good for him.

I can't wait to hear how things are going for the Phillies in year eight.

They will be looking to dump him on the Red Sox or Dodgers.

15 hours ago, BigOrange1 said:

i think it's pretty awesome how obvious it is that bryce harper doesn't want to go to philly.

nailed it.

1 minute ago, bschoolprof said:

nailed it.

Well, he kind of did.  It took a godfather deal to land him.

Saw an interesting point on twitter - do you think different about 13 years if the NL adopts the DH in the next CBA? 

1 minute ago, TonyTexas said:


$330mm/13 yrs, while a great contract, is less than I thought he would get. Machado got $300mm/10 yrs. Arenado got $260/8 yrs. Harper’s deal has no deferred money. Don’t know about the other guys structure.

I think because its a little bit less Trout can get even more on an AAV, though I could even see him taking a slight home team discount.

1 minute ago, Wild Bill said:

giphy.gif

350 Mil next year?

 

It will be in 2021 and maybe $450.

Trout has been more valuable than Harper and Machado combined. I’m sure his salary won’t reflect THAT, but it should be closer to $500 than $300.

23 minutes ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

I watch 5 innings a year...is Harper that good? This seems insane

It’s really not that insane. It’s only $25M a year which is what A-Rod got from the Rangers and MLB revenues have doubled since then. Sure it’s a lot of years, but the actual dollar value is very reasonable.

also yeah he’s pretty good 

27 minutes ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

I watch 5 innings a year...is Harper that good? This seems insane

I love watching him hit moonshot dingers, but I think he's incredibly overrated.  

Harper is all over the board - tons of strikeouts, bad defense but great walk rate and will always hit bombs. It's not like he's been in a bad lineup. I'm hoping Citizens Bank Park helps him with both HRs and defense (more playable corner spots).

There's no way it's a bad contract unless he gets major injuries in the early years. A lot of people (inc. national media) thought he would average more than $35 million over 10 years. This is like $33 million  over 10 years plus three years free!

This also makes Trout to Philly (his hometown, just across the river) a very real thing from both a trade and FA perspective for the next couple years. Y'all are going to get sick of media talking about it, will he go home or take a Yankee mega-mega-deal?

The Phillies still have challenges. Rotation isn't really playoff-worthy. Minor league system very sparse which hurts in terms of trade chips and also just general depth. But man it's good to be able to believe for the first time in almost a decade.

3 minutes ago, Bartles said:

 

This also makes Trout to Philly (his hometown, just across the river) a very real thing from both a trade and FA perspective for the next couple years. Y'all are going to get sick of media talking about it, will he go home or take a Yankee mega-mega-deal?

 

Trout will be a Yankee. Bank on it.

I hate he’s still in the NL East, but the Nats did more with their spend over multiple acquisitions than just give it to Harper. He won’t be very welcome in DC

The money per year doesn't bother me in the least. And in the next 3-5 years baring a major injury it's a no brainer.

What makes this contract insane is the 13 year and more specifically 13 years with no opt out. THAT part of the contract is crazy. 

 

The NL is going to be awesome this year. Good luck picking 5 teams out of that group. 

best comment i read so far about the contract length.

 

"There are Phillies fans not yet born that will be throwing batteries at him in the later years of this contract".

Edited by MAROON

It’s really not that insane. It’s only $25M a year which is what A-Rod got from the Rangers and MLB revenues have doubled since then. Sure it’s a lot of years, but the actual dollar value is very reasonable.
also yeah he’s pretty good 

What this post pre-supposes is....
That A-Rod deal was reasonable at the time.
  • Author
13 minutes ago, TheFlagship said:

The NL is going to be awesome this year. Good luck picking 5 teams out of that group. 

No shit.  Who has made the most noise in the AL in free agency?  Minnesota?

best comment i read so far about the contract length.
 
"There are Phillies fans not yet to be born that will be throwing batteries at him in the later years of this contract".

I’d hate to be the Santa at the Citizens Bank Park “Christmas in July” promotion day in 2031
15 minutes ago, Beau Vine said:

No shit.  Who has made the most noise in the AL in free agency?  Minnesota?

You aren’t impressed with Asdrubal,  Lance Lynn and Shelby Miller?! 

Logan Forsythe, Jett Bandy, Tony Sanchez, Adam Moore, Danny Santana, Nolan Fontana, Chase d’Arnaud, Ben Revere, bro! 

22 minutes ago, Beau Vine said:

No shit.  Who has made the most noise in the AL in free agency?  Minnesota?

dude the Blue Jays just signed Bud Norris! 

2 hours ago, Pig Bellmont said:

I hate he’s still in the NL East, but the Nats did more with their spend over multiple acquisitions than just give it to Harper. He won’t be very welcome in DC

Oh he'll get a huge ovation at Nationals Park. Seems to be at least 30 pct Phillies fans even in the recent down years

That was LOL about the batteries...hopefully by then we're throwing micro-solar panels instead though

2 hours ago, UTexasFight said:


What this post pre-supposes is....
That A-Rod deal was reasonable at the time.

I'd argue that it was. $25mm then was certainly more than it is now, but these were A-Rod's WAR (B-R) totals, for 10 years starting in 2001 (the original deal was 10 years, he opted out after the 2007 season and basically signed this deal again): 8.3, 8.8, 8.4, 7.6, 9.4, 4.5, 9.4, 6.8, 4.2, 4.2

So, that's 7.2 WAR per year for 10 years. That's MVP-caliber play for a decade. This was one of the rare enormous FA contracts that actually worked out. 

Now, I understand that the Rangers didn't win anything with A-Rod, and ultimately traded him because the contract was prohibitive of them building a team around him (I guess); but that doesn't mean that A-Rod was overpaid - it means that Texas didn't draft and develop other players well enough in that era to take advantage of having one of the 3 best players in the game (at the time, along with Bonds and Pujols) on their team. 

16 minutes ago, Hank Chinaski said:

I'd argue that it was. $25mm then was certainly more than it is now, but these were A-Rod's WAR (B-R) totals, for 10 years starting in 2001 (the original deal was 10 years, he opted out after the 2007 season and basically signed this deal again): 8.3, 8.8, 8.4, 7.6, 9.4, 4.5, 9.4, 6.8, 4.2, 4.2

So, that's 7.2 WAR per year for 10 years. That's MVP-caliber play for a decade. This was one of the rare enormous FA contracts that actually worked out. 

Now, I understand that the Rangers didn't win anything with A-Rod, and ultimately traded him because the contract was prohibitive of them building a team around him (I guess); but that doesn't mean that A-Rod was overpaid - it means that Texas didn't draft and develop other players well enough in that era to take advantage of having one of the 3 best players in the game (at the time, along with Bonds and Pujols) on their team. 

Agreed. Also steroids happened

3 hours ago, Wild Bill said:

Trout will be a Yankee. Bank on it.

No he won’t. Current NY ownership has made it crystal clear they don’t care about doing what it takes to win. They just want to line their pockets. 

What a disaster of an off-season for the MLB. 2 of its biggest stars end up at franchises that no one cares about, with non-existent fan bases. 

Philly=San Diego. I mean, I gotta respect the New Yorkiness of that post... that's why I aways go for NYY>BOS

1 hour ago, Helobious said:

No he won’t. Current NY ownership has made it crystal clear they don’t care about doing what it takes to win. They just want to line their pockets. 

What a disaster of an off-season for the MLB. 2 of its biggest stars end up at franchises that no one cares about, with non-existent fan bases. 

 

the next players strike will be ugly

 

hopefully the astros have open tryouts for scab players, im already in training 

5 hours ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

I watch 5 innings a year...is Harper that good? This seems insane

He puts up numbers but the advanced stats have him worth way less than you'd expect

5 hours ago, Wild Bill said:

Trout will be a Yankee. Bank on it.

For some reason, I could actually see Trout doing another extension with the Angels. Maybe that's because he already sold them a few of his FA years, maybe it's because he's a low-key guy. But I wouldn't be shocked if he never hits free agency. 

For some reason, I could actually see Trout doing another extension with the Angels. Maybe that's because he already sold them a few of his FA years, maybe it's because he's a low-key guy. But I wouldn't be shocked if he never hits free agency. 


I hope not.
As a fan of baseball, I’d like to see the greatest player of his generation actually win a playoff game

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