Jump to content
View in the app

A better way to browse. Learn more.

Surly Horns

A full-screen app on your home screen with push notifications, badges and more.

To install this app on iOS and iPadOS
  1. Tap the Share icon in Safari
  2. Scroll the menu and tap Add to Home Screen.
  3. Tap Add in the top-right corner.
To install this app on Android
  1. Tap the 3-dot menu (⋮) in the top-right corner of the browser.
  2. Tap Add to Home screen or Install app.
  3. Confirm by tapping Install.
Football ... Basketball ... Baseball ... Other Sports ... Futbol ... 🤫995🤫 ... Gambling ... Movies & TV ... Music ... Hobbies ... Lulz ... Food & Travel ... Daily Texan ... Business & Markets ... Cloak Room ... Help ... For Sale ... Board Discussion ... Advertise... Tailgate Donations

Featured Replies

Just now, mdmost said:

Can I finish? Can I finish?

He finished, Jim

He gave us the 22 class size limit in elementary school and no-pass, no-play.  In 1984, I remember him talking about Texas' amazing collection of high school football palaces and our need to focus more on education and less on extracurriculars.  We have come a long way ... those 1984 era stadiums look like crap compared to what we have today!

My Eagle Scout award came with a note of congratulations from Perot.  I heard he paid for all of the awards for Texas Eagle Scouts, but I'm not sure if that's true.

Edited by Texas Jeff

He was the first viable answer to the notion (fallacious, IMHO) that we need a businessman running the government. I didn't vote for him, but I certainly didn't think the country would be doomed if he were elected. Would have been interesting having a president without a corresponding party in Congress.

RIP Ross. Seemed like a pretty decent guy.

Who am I?  Why am I here?

(Yeah, not him, but close enough and it always makes me laugh).
RIP, cowboy!

26 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

He was the first viable answer to the notion (fallacious, IMHO) that we need a businessman running the government. I didn't vote for him, but I certainly didn't think the country would be doomed if he were elected. Would have been interesting having a president without a corresponding party in Congress.

RIP Ross. Seemed like a pretty decent guy.

Thanks for saving me the words, you nailed my thoughts pretty well here. RIP H.

I was not a fan of his, but he was right about NAFTA.  He absolutely shredded Gore in their debate regarding that issue in 93.

 

Sad that he's known for his graphs.  Y'all should read On Wings of Eagles by Ken Follett.  It's the story of how Perot got his two guys out of Iran just prior to the hostage crisis.  The incompetent State Dept. circa 1979 wouldn't do shit to help them and he got them out.

I thought I heard a giant sucking sound this morning...

2 hours ago, Red Five said:

Holy shit. I would have bet a ton of money that he was already dead. 

My wife asked me about  a month ago "is Ross Perot dead" and I answered "of course".

Would have been a terribly interesting president.  He legitimately cared about the deficit unlike anyone before or since.  He also wouldn't have been moored to any one party.  That may have been good or may have been a disaster, not sure.

Also, he was what Donald Trump pretends to be.  Legit billionaire based some innovative risks back in the day and diversified into real estate later.

He funded an operation to rescue employees who were arrested in Iran in 1979. That alone makes him a badass in my book.

I highly recommend reading On Wings of Eagles.

Just now, LonghornD said:

He funded an operation to rescue employees who were arrested in Iran in 1979. That alone makes him a badass in my book.

I highly recommend reading On Wings of Eagles.

So do it (post 15).

Great writeup by the Morning News.

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/business/2019/07/09/ross-perot-self-made-billionaire-patriot-philanthropist-dies-89

 

A 10,000-square-foot library that's part of the Perot Group's headquarters features a mind-boggling array of memorabilia, including Osama bin Laden's walking cane, which was given to Perot by the special forces who killed the terrorist.

 

 

16 minutes ago, Wally Pryor said:

Great writeup by the Morning News.

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/business/2019/07/09/ross-perot-self-made-billionaire-patriot-philanthropist-dies-89

 

A 10,000-square-foot library that's part of the Perot Group's headquarters features a mind-boggling array of memorabilia, including Osama bin Laden's walking cane, which was given to Perot by the special forces who killed the terrorist.

 

 

I have been there, it has to be seen to be believed. In my hazy memory, I could swear there was a NASA spacesuit there as well.

 

2 hours ago, Fozzz said:

He absolutely shredded Gore in their debate regarding that issue in 93.

 

Really? That's not how I remember it from watching it at the time, but it's been 25+ years. I thought the consensus afterwards was (and I certainly remember feeling) Gore handed Perot's ass to him. 

54 minutes ago, tantric superman said:

My wife asked me about  a month ago "is Ross Perot dead" and I answered "of course".

Now you can tell her it's proof that you're a visionary.

2 hours ago, Fozzz said:

I was not a fan of his, but he was right about NAFTA.  He absolutely shredded Gore in their debate regarding that issue in 93.

 

The only alternative to free trade is protectionism.

Gotta choose one.

48 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

Would have been a terribly interesting president.  He legitimately cared about the deficit unlike anyone before or since.  He also wouldn't have been moored to any one party.  That may have been good or may have been a disaster, not sure.

Also, he was what Donald Trump pretends to be.  Legit billionaire based some innovative risks back in the day and diversified into real estate later.

Agree.  He sure seemed to be a self-made man, who was genuinely decent and caring.  RIP

1 hour ago, tantric superman said:

My wife asked me about  a month ago "is Ross Perot dead" and I answered "of course".

please don't have her ask about Armybrat, Earl or even me

 

21 minutes ago, Wally Fairway said:

please don't have her ask about Armybrat, Earl or even me

 

on the other hand, if she were to ask about Phlegm... 

1 hour ago, LonghornD said:

He funded an operation to rescue employees who were arrested in Iran in 1979. That alone makes him a badass in my book.

I highly recommend reading On Wings of Eagles.

Was that made into a movie?

1 hour ago, tantric superman said:

My wife asked me about  a month ago "is Ross Perot dead" and I answered "of course".

This is my first experience with the Mandela Effect. It's unsettling. 

40 minutes ago, SwanderedTalent said:

I have been there, it has to be seen to be believed. In my hazy memory, I could swear there was a NASA spacesuit there as well.

 

Really? That's not how I remember it from watching it at the time, but it's been 25+ years. I thought the consensus afterwards was (and I certainly remember feeling) Gore handed Perot's ass to him. 

Some people may have believed that at the time but time has born out the fact that Perot was right and Gore was wrong, particularly on how the agreement would affect Mexico.

Quote

As was well known at the time of NAFTA’s passage, the main purpose of NAFTA was to lock in a set of economic policies, some of which were already well under way in the decade prior, including the liberalization of manufacturing, foreign investment and ownership, and other changes.  The idea was that the continuation and expansion of these policies would allow Mexico to achieve efficiencies and economic progress that was not possible under the developmentalist, protectionist economic model that had prevailed in the decades before 1980. While some of the policy changes were undoubtedly necessary and/or positive, the end result has been decades of economic failure by almost any economic or social indicator. This is true whether we compare Mexico to its developmentalist past, or even if the comparison is to the rest of Latin America since NAFTA. After 20 years, these results should provoke more public discussion as to what went wrong.

http://cepr.net/documents/nafta-20-years-2014-02.pdf

Just now, Fozzz said:

Some people may have believed that at the time but time has born out the fact that Perot was right and Gore was wrong, particularly on how the agreement would affect Mexico.

OK. I wasn't arguing NAFTA pro or con. I was talking about the perceived debate winner, at the time. 

16 minutes ago, Red Five said:

Yes. It's called Iron Eagle. 

Thanks, has Louis Gosset Jr in it I think.

53 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

The only alternative to free trade is protectionism.

Gotta choose one.

This is silly and extremely reductive.  Practically every state engages in some form of protectionism even in this current epoch of unprecedented market liberalization.  Truly "free" trade is an impossibility, just as truly "free" markets are an impossibility.  What matters is what you want to achieve through your trade policies - do you give a shit about your workers or do you only care about maximizing short run GDP growth?

Benjamin Studebaker had a good piece recently about why the free trade vs protectionism frame is right wing garbage.

Quote

This is what the right wants—a false binary choice between helping poor people in developing countries and defending poor and working people at home. It wants to frame trade as a dichotomy between free trade policies that lift poor countries out of poverty while making consumer goods cheap for us and protectionist policies that defend American jobs while keeping poor countries poor and expensive goods expensive. The right wants to use your compassion for postcolonial peoples to make you stab your neighbors in the back. And before too long, it won’t just be your neighbors who suffer—you too will end up afflicted with the consequences of austerity, poor quality products, and chronic under-investment in infrastructure and productivity. It’s already happening. Look around you.

So what is to be done? We don’t have to accept this false choice. We can trade with other countries on terms that protect our workers and force other states to treat their workers better than we treated ours in the 19th century. Rich states should demand, as a condition of trade agreements, adjustments in wages, taxes, and regulations to reduce or eliminate disparities in the treatment of rich workers and poor workers. It’s one thing if we import stuff from a foreign state because that state has real productive advantages in making the stuff. It’s quite another if we’re importing stuff from a foreign state because that state is treating its workers like meat.

Right now, free trade agreements are being used to run down workers in rich states while giving workers in poor states far too little compensation for far too much hardship. The USA and the EU command access to gigantic consumer markets, and they have a lot of leverage over governments in developing countries. Instead of using that leverage to push these governments to offer up their workers on a platter for transnational corporations to devour at their leisure, we ought to use our leverage to secure workers around the world fairer deals. Beyond this, we ought to demand that developing states take action to ensure they fight poverty in a clean, sustainable way—and supply them with the investment and extra help, where necessary, to do this.

This is what a socialist trade policy looks like—not unadulterated protectionism, but trade deals that put workers first by creating strong international minimum standards on wages, taxes, and regulations. This must be led by the USA and EU, because only they command enough market share to successfully push governments in poor countries to adopt more humane and sustainable models of development.

https://www.currentaffairs.org/2019/05/how-the-left-should-think-about-trade

1 minute ago, Hank Scorpio said:

 

Don’t forget how he lamented the decline in manufacturing but made his money doing IT services and processing.

I didn't know anything about that story, book, or movie until this thread, but if you had described it to me and given me the relevant time frame, I would have bet $100 that Richard Crenna was cast in it. 

Edited by Prepuce of Doom

48 minutes ago, rage-a-holic said:

51+p7kQ2fGL._SY445_.jpg

So it wasn't "Iron Eagle 3"? Disappoint.

And when the Treaty Oak was poisoned in '89, Perot called city arborists and said "Do whatever you need to do to save the tree, and send me the bill."

News to me.  Heard it on the local newscast tonight.

 

Holy shit. I would have bet a ton of money that he was already dead. 

Yea, no kidding.   I thought Lee Iacocca was dead to until last week  when his Obit showed up.

I was a kid during his debates so he always seemed kind of kooky but goddamnit now I know what a fine and decent man he was. Go rest high on that mountain RP!

He had a campaign speech in Boyd right before he announced he was running that I really wanted to go to but had to miss because of work. United We Stand was a popular grass roots movement back in the day. It had a legit chance at becoming a third party before Ross melted down.

one of a kind, we were lucky to have this great American.  A genuine man with integrity who cared for the people. Was thinking of him just last week and poof now it's over. 

Not widely known but he provided healthcare (surgeries, wound care, family bills) to a number of service personnel /veterans per year out of his own pocket. Airfare would be provided by his own personal plane and the patient/veteran flown to his team of doctors in the Dallas area.  

After my brother in law was shot down (Kiowa pilot)in Iraq in 2004, my wife (no pics) was visiting him in SAAMC at Ft Sam when they received a call from him (Ross) one night in between surgeries. He would have the plane there that night if Cody was not receiving the proper care or treatment from his Docs ( they originally wanted to amputate his left arm). It was an open invitation if at anytime my BIL thought that his care was substandard. He Thanked him and after denying the offer, Mr Perot asked him who was working on him, when my BIL told him him the main surgeons name, Ross laughed and said, "Oh, you're in good hands, that is one of my guys".   

RIP Ross

Edited by BillyGoatHill

Sad that he's known for his graphs.  Y'all should read On Wings of Eagles by Ken Follett.  It's the story of how Perot got his two guys out of Iran just prior to the hostage crisis.  The incompetent State Dept. circa 1979 wouldn't do shit to help them and he got them out.

I know one of Perot’s lawyers who was attempting to negotiate their release with the Iranians. Needless to say he has some great stories.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...
Football ... Basketball ... Baseball ... Other Sports ... Futbol ... 🤫995🤫 ... Gambling ... Movies & TV ... Music ... Hobbies ... Lulz ... Food & Travel ... Daily Texan ... Business & Markets ... Cloak Room ... Help ... For Sale ... Board Discussion ... Advertise... Tailgate Donations

Configure browser push notifications

Chrome (Android)
  1. Tap the lock icon next to the address bar.
  2. Tap Permissions → Notifications.
  3. Adjust your preference.
Chrome (Desktop)
  1. Click the padlock icon in the address bar.
  2. Select Site settings.
  3. Find Notifications and adjust your preference.